Spouses as separate constituents - would like opinions

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We are a 9-12 school integrated with the Education Edge. EE is kind of considered out "primary" database as that is where most records are generated initially (parents, grandparents, alumni, staff). Moms and Dads each have a record, and depending on the situation, step-parents might as well. We are now having a conflict of opinon between two departments 



Database admin, which includes the administration of RE, is a separate department from development. Development wants one household record, but database admin wants separate. Development wishes to treat all gifts as from the couple, essentially, to treat them as one entity and not worry about soft crediting or looking up a second record to see gifts, events, etc. The couple is in all but extremely rare cases recognized and mailed to as a couple. I know RE was set up to make this very easy to do, but it has been hammered home to me in all Blackbaud trainings I've had that if the constituent has a relationship with the org beyond being the spouse of a constituent, they should have their own record.



Data dept would like them separate and linked together as spouses, as they each have a relationship (both are parents), and it complicates integration and the flow of data updates. Additionally, we have run into problems with querying, reporting, and mailings when a spouse (read: the wife) who is only a relation and not a full constituent is a volunteer, a member of our women's auxiliary club, an officer in a parent organization, gives on a credit card or a check wih only her name, is an event chair or on an event committee, etc. Or, when spouses divorce or one passes away. 



I'm on the side that they be separate. I have been asked to merge wives into the husband's record to make it "joint." We are likely to have a meeting about this with several management and executive-level staff members to hash this out and resolve it. 



Has your org faced this conflict? What was the resolution? What do you think, should RE have "couple" records or have separate? Am I out of line for resisting the development department when it is "their" database?
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Comments

  • I think you cited most of the reasons for them being separate.  It's a big hassle to keep track of things like officer of a parent org when the individual does not have their own record. 



    What other than less records is the reason database admin wants them on one record?  If EE has them as separate why would RE need them together.  You say it's "their database" so yes you'll have to work with them - hopefully both looking at what will work best today as well as 5, 10 years from now.  There are definitely pros/cons for both ways.  Hopefully you'll get some responses from other schools that have dealt with the issue.  Have you read some of the past posts on the topic?



    If there's a reason for each spouse to have their own record, that's the way we go.  I will say I wish RE did a better job of handling address changes for linked records.  That's the only time I wish the two had one record.
  • We had this discussion when I first started at my current organization.  Their process had been to just have one record for the household, but then history was being lost if the non-primary spouse attended an event by themselevs, joined a committee, we had notes just specific to them, etc.  These were not being captured in any logical way, and then the development office was wondering why they could not easily see if that spouse attended an event by themselves or not, etc.  



    Now our process is we start with one record for the couple, with whoever we have the "closer" relationship to as the primary, otherwise we default to having the husband be the primary.  At any point, if the non-primary spouse attended an event on their own, makes a donation just from themselves, joins a committee, volunteers, etc. they are immediately broken out into their own full record (of course staying linked as spouses).  Then moving forward, if we have any actions, notes, relationships, etc. that pertain to both spouses they are added to each record, otherwise information just specific to each spouse is put on their own record.  It seemed this might be cumbersome with entering some things twice, but it really only takes moments to add them to both.  We now have a business rule when if a record is opened and their spouse has a full record as well, a window pops up saying the spouse has a full record.  That way the user knows they can also check the spouse record for any additional information they may be looking for.  



    This process has worked really well for us.  We don't have a ton of them, but it really helps with better accuracy when pulling lists on who came to events, is on a committee, etc.  We also felt it makes us look more "on top of it" when we can easily address letters to just the spouse who came to the event or gave a donation, and not just address it to the household.  I know there are ways to still do these things with just one record for the household, but this really streamlined the process and made things much easier.  



     
  • JoAnn Strommen:

    I think you cited most of the reasons for them being separate.  It's a big hassle to keep track of things like officer of a parent org when the individual does not have their own record. 



    What other than less records is the reason database admin wants them on one record?  If EE has them as separate why would RE need them together.  You say it's "their database" so yes you'll have to work with them - hopefully both looking at what will work best today as well as 5, 10 years from now.  There are definitely pros/cons for both ways.  Hopefully you'll get some responses from other schools that have dealt with the issue.  Have you read some of the past posts on the topic?



    If there's a reason for each spouse to have their own record, that's the way we go.  I will say I wish RE did a better job of handling address changes for linked records.  That's the only time I wish the two had one record.

    Yes, the address change issue, especially when it is changed via integration, is a problem. I think we've found a resolution. When the EE admin makes changes, I receive a report on it, and check the RE records to ensure addresses for both spouses are marked correctly as Preferred and Previous. 



    I've seen many topics on arguments for why they should or should not be, but I'm wondering if the fact that we are integrated with EE means that they emphatically should be separate/this shouldn't even be a question, as our Database Admin department head believes, or if any org that has both and keeps couples as one record in RE has advice or a guide on how to do it correctly. 

  • Ann Milkowski:

    We had this discussion when I first started at my current organization.  Their process had been to just have one record for the household, but then history was being lost if the non-primary spouse attended an event by themselevs, joined a committee, we had notes just specific to them, etc.  These were not being captured in any logical way, and then the development office was wondering why they could not easily see if that spouse attended an event by themselves or not, etc.  



    Now our process is we start with one record for the couple, with whoever we have the "closer" relationship to as the primary, otherwise we default to having the husband be the primary.  At any point, if the non-primary spouse attended an event on their own, makes a donation just from themselves, joins a committee, volunteers, etc. they are immediately broken out into their own full record (of course staying linked as spouses).  Then moving forward, if we have any actions, notes, relationships, etc. that pertain to both spouses they are added to each record, otherwise information just specific to each spouse is put on their own record.  It seemed this might be cumbersome with entering some things twice, but it really only takes moments to add them to both.  We now have a business rule when if a record is opened and their spouse has a full record as well, a window pops up saying the spouse has a full record.  That way the user knows they can also check the spouse record for any additional information they may be looking for.  



    This process has worked really well for us.  We don't have a ton of them, but it really helps with better accuracy when pulling lists on who came to events, is on a committee, etc.  We also felt it makes us look more "on top of it" when we can easily address letters to just the spouse who came to the event or gave a donation, and not just address it to the household.  I know there are ways to still do these things with just one record for the household, but this really streamlined the process and made things much easier.  



     

    Thank you! I like this approach as a compromise. It can just be hard when typically the women are the primary right off the bat with giving and volunteering, and since the men are automatically the constituent (and always the HoH and decision-maker in development's view), it would be more manual work than I'd prefer. But then reducing my own workload might be selfish ;)

  • Development wants one household record, but database admin wants separate. Development wishes to treat all gifts as from the couple, essentially, to treat them as one entity and not worry about soft crediting or looking up a second record to see gifts, events, etc. 

    This argument seems to not consider longevity of the records -- so what happens when Mr. and Mrs. Smith divorce, these two people may not always be a couple.  At that time, would you create a new record for the former Mrs. Smith and then have to put soft credits for their joint giving and event attendance on her record?  Who's going to remember to do that correctly and what a mess...!!



    I think it's much cleaner to follow the best practices recommended by Blackbaud - you have two people who have a relationship so set them each up with a record and create a relationship.  This relationship is then subject to change (divorce, death) but all the basic gift, event, appeal data will already be where it needs to be.




     
  • surprise I read Kate's post more than twice.  Thought it ironic that development wants one record and database admin two.  Seems like it's usually the opposite.  Can't imagine that development would not want the detail provided by separate records.
  • Gina Gerhard:

    This argument seems to not consider longevity of the records -- so what happens when Mr. and Mrs. Smith divorce, these two people may not always be a couple.  At that time, would you create a new record for the former Mrs. Smith and then have to put soft credits for their joint giving and event attendance on her record?  Who's going to remember to do that correctly and what a mess...!!



    I think it's much cleaner to follow the best practices recommended by Blackbaud - you have two people who have a relationship so set them each up with a record and create a relationship.  This relationship is then subject to change (divorce, death) but all the basic gift, event, appeal data will already be where it needs to be.




     

     

    Thank you Gina. I agree, and you've put it excellently. This way of looking forward as the org grows in time and positions change and staff move on is an important point to bring up.

  • JoAnn Strommen:

    surprise I read Kate's post more than twice.  Thought it ironic that development wants one record and database admin two.  Seems like it's usually the opposite.  Can't imagine that development would not want the detail provided by separate records.

    I come from development! That might be why. I like working in the database so much I want to take some classes and learn SQL, python, etc. I thought I was done after my Master's - guess not. I worked in both political campaigns and another nonprofit, and started in development here before our database dept was able to have a position for an RE admin. No one in our Dev team had ever used RE before coming here; I was the first hire with experience in it. 

  • For our organization it really isn't the man who automatically is the primary and gets marked as the HOH.  If it was the woman who first made a donation, reached out to volunteer, etc. she is made the primary so there really isn't much "clean-up".  
  • Ann Milkowski:

    For our organization it really isn't the man who automatically is the primary and gets marked as the HOH.  If it was the woman who first made a donation, reached out to volunteer, etc. she is made the primary so there really isn't much "clean-up".  

    Gotcha. The way it's been in the past here is the man is automatically the constituent as they flow from EE, while the female spouse is just a relation and her full EE record hasn't flowed.

  • I work at a JK-12 school, and we have 1 record per household. Generally the male is the lead record (there is a set rule of exceptions). We track participation in the PA Board (either as grade reps or officers) in attributes with the appropriate parent name, and attendance at events in Actions. We also use specific addressee/salutations for the spouse who is on the PA Board or has other roles.



    When spouses divorce, then the one who was linked gets her own record and we soft credit all of the previous gifts and copy the attributes and actions as appropriate.



    If the lead spouse dies, then we flip the records.



    If a current parent marries another current parent, each one keeps their own record and we give one record an attribute that will exclude them from mailings so they don't get duplicates of everything.
  • Ellen Turner:

    I work at a JK-12 school, and we have 1 record per household. Generally the male is the lead record (there is a set rule of exceptions). We track participation in the PA Board (either as grade reps or officers) in attributes with the appropriate parent name, and attendance at events in Actions. We also use specific addressee/salutations for the spouse who is on the PA Board or has other roles.



    When spouses divorce, then the one who was linked gets her own record and we soft credit all of the previous gifts and copy the attributes and actions as appropriate.



    If the lead spouse dies, then we flip the records.



    If a current parent marries another current parent, each one keeps their own record and we give one record an attribute that will exclude them from mailings so they don't get duplicates of everything.

    Thank you, Ellen! If I do have to have one household record in RE this is an excellent roadmap. 



    Do you also have Education Edge?

  • Our organization uses joint accounts in Development. The reason is because it makes it so much easier to do financial accounting without the mess of soft credits on reports, and because it minimizes duplicate mailings.



    We have usually made the male the primary; however, like Ellen says, there are exceptions if the woman reaches out to us first, has the main relationship with us, or if it is the woman's record we obtained in a mailing list rental. If the husband dies, the wife becomes the primary and we just switch the names in the record fields. The only time we don't do this is with Alumni... if the Alumnus dies, the spouse receives a new record, and the Alumnus retains primary place in his Constituent record, so that we can retain the Alumni data for him. I imagine if you had male and female students, and they married each other, each would need his own record.



    We emphatically do not soft credit gifts, even when creating a new record for a divorced spouse. We simply add a pop-up note and relationship link identifying the former marriage relationship and referring to the spouse's record for more details. We also add appropriate mailing codes to ensure they receive the correct appeals and event-related mailings. This system has always worked well for us, and we have used RE for about 15 years.

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